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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Rating info on disc |
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Registered: June 12, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,665 |
| Posted: | | | | A month ago i submitted an update for Bad Santa: The Unrated Version and Director's Cut [786936-745573] to add rating info as found on the jacket itself. It was approved without issue or any No votes that i recall.
The disc contains two versions of the film (menu selectable)...one is rated NR, the other R.
Now there is a contribution to remove the rating info, apparently because the profile rating (NR) doesn't have rating info associated with it. Two ratings are listed on the jacket, one is NR the other is 'R' with the official MPAA logo and rating info.
I added the info because
1) nothing in the Rules requires the profile rating and the info to correspond 2) having some info, especially from a valid source, is better than none.
I'd be interested in other thoughts on whether this rating info should be removed. | | | Bad movie? You're soaking in it! | | | Last edited: by tweeter |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Posts: 4,596 |
| Posted: | | | | NR is the Higher Rating therefore, if it's NR there is no rating info. | | | My WebGenDVD online Collection |
| Registered: March 18, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,550 |
| Posted: | | | | This discussion came up before, which is why I removed the rating details: http://www.invelos.com/Forums.aspx?task=viewtopic&topicID=333384&PageNum=1 |
| Registered: March 14, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 4,684 |
| Posted: | | | | It seems obvious to me that when you have Rating and Rating Details, the details should refer to the rating listed. Anything else would be totally illogical. | | | My freeware tools for DVD Profiler users. Gunnar |
| Registered: May 8, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 1,945 |
| Posted: | | | | NR overrules R-rated, so no rating info greetings Donnie | | | www.tvmaze.com |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 13,202 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting GSyren: Quote: It seems obvious to me that when you have Rating and Rating Details, the details should refer to the rating listed. Anything else would be totally illogical. Agreed. The rating detal should match the rating listed. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever. There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom. Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand. The Centauri learned this lesson once. We will teach it to them again. Though it take a thousand years, we will be free. - Citizen G'Kar |
| Registered: June 12, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,665 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting GSyren: Quote: Anything else would be totally illogical. Not totally illogical. Both versions are mentioned in the Edition field and both ratings are on the jacket. Logic was applied when i added it (Empty field with valid info from the disc available). But i will defer to the common wisdom and withdraw my No vote. P.S. Movieman, how about referencing either this or the original thread in your contribution notes for future reference. | | | Bad movie? You're soaking in it! |
| Registered: March 18, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,550 |
| Posted: | | | | Will do. |
| Registered: May 9, 2008 | Posts: 467 |
| Posted: | | | | I feel there are two cases:
1) A disc that contains multiple version of the content, R vs. Unrated for example. 2) A disc that only contains unrated content.
For the first case, I am split as I feel the rating details still contains valid data and should be included. I've only seen unrated versions that would add additional data and not remove data. However, until there is support for multiple ratings for a single disc I can see how the data can be misleading or incorrect depending on which version someone decides to watch.
For the second case if there are rating details I see no reason way they should not be included. I have multiple unrated discs that have rating details.
Tom |
| Registered: May 26, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,879 |
| Posted: | | | | Hmm ... I'm a bit torn. Like tkinnen, I have some unrated discs in my collection that have content warnings attached to them. I have not included those details in anything other than my local, as I feel it is currently inappropriate given the contribution guidelines as they stand.
However, there is another side to the argument - an unrated version of a film that has been previously rated still contains the same content that it was given that rating for. The unrated version, indeed, contains more of it. Lets take the film Death Race for an example. It's rated R for strong violence and language. The unrated DVD contains the same content, if not stronger (I'm not even sure if that film is available on DVD in the theatrical release - I certainly haven't seen it in the store). Therefore, I feel that the content warning is still valid. It still gives you information as to the content of the film.
These unrated versions of films are different, IMO, than actual NR films. If you look at ratings for the tools they are in describing the content of the film, no one could well argue that The Wizard of Oz has the same rating as Death Race, even though both are NR. Indeed, why is NR the higher rating? NR is simply no rating. It is not an actual rating. It is even listed as the first rating on the drop-down menu - below G.
Yes, I understand that by the rules NR takes precedence and abide by that in contribution. However, I do not agree with that interpretation. I will offer a couple of proposals that might help both sides, agree or disagree, at least it's something to add to the conversation.
-- Have separate listings for "Not Rated" and "Unrated." That would enable older films, made under code (or pre-code) to be listed as "Not Rated (NR)" and those films that are made today and then released differently on DVD to be listed as "Unrated." It would visibly demonstrate the difference that I (and perhaps others, I don't know) see between old movies and modern movies. Direct-to-video releases would fall under "Not Rated" as they have not been previously rated. NR would fall under G, while Unrated would fall between R and NC-17 for being the stronger genre.
-- For films that were previously rated and are being released in unrated DVD editions, to list the film as Unrated/Not Rated but to include the content warning for the rating it was given in the box office, since the film still contains the content that it was given the rating for. The content did not disappear with the addition of footage to an unrated edition. If anything, the content is simply stronger. This would equally apply to those DVDs with multiple versions of a film. | | | If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world. -- Thorin Oakenshield | | | Last edited: by Danae Cassandra |
| Registered: August 22, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 1,807 |
| Posted: | | | | @Danae Cassandra
I see your point, but that's the way the rating system works, and we can just record the rating that is on the cover, not the rating that was on the cover but is not there any more, IMHO. If I was interested in the rating of a rated version I would copy it from the rated version profile and paste it locally into the unrated profile. | | | -- Enry | | | Last edited: by White Pongo, Jr. |
| Registered: May 26, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,879 |
| Posted: | | | | Ah, but my two points can be taken separately. I understood when making the first one that it was likely unpopular. But my second point - that we could record the content warning without changing the rating given on the cover - can still apply to unrated editions. | | | If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world. -- Thorin Oakenshield |
| Registered: March 19, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 6,018 |
| Posted: | | | | Interesting suggestion, Danae Cassandra! I find it a bit hard, being a non-US user, to think it through in all its implications, but I do see your point(s). |
| Registered: May 18, 2007 | Posts: 232 |
| Posted: | | | | I guess the rating is there to stop people from watching films they may be offended by. So I would go with the lowest/hardest rating. I'm not sure what rating "R" is , but if you have rating 18 and rating 15, I would rate the profile with 15. |
| Registered: May 26, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,879 |
| Posted: | | | | Gemini, a quick rundown of ratings in the US for you - G (any age admitted), PG (recommend parents), PG-13 (recommend parents if under 13), R (adult required to accompany under 17), NC-17 (must be over 17 for admission). A film may also not be rated at all.
Don't know how things work in Norway, but theaters here in the US are exceedingly unlikely to show an unrated or NC-17 film (I only remember one ever showing in nearby Louisville, and that was The Cook, The Thief, His Wife and Her Lover). However, unrated DVDs sell extremely well - in my store, most often much better than the theatrical releases when both are available. | | | If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world. -- Thorin Oakenshield | | | Last edited: by Danae Cassandra |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 2,293 |
| Posted: | | | | Of course what Danae Cassandra very nicely explains just goes to show that it's very difficult to get a hard-and-fast simple Rule to cover all eventualities because of the differences between localities.
For example in the UK we have U (any age), PG (Parents recommended), 12A (over 12s by themsleves, under 12s only if with someone older - note this automatically becomes a 12 for the DVD which is must be 12 to buy), 15 (over 15s) and 18 (must be over 18). Note that cinemas here have absolutely no trouble or worries showing 18s.
Then we come to NR - NR in the UK is only applicable to DVDs and is used for schools/education/documentaries which are suitable for most anyone. Therefore an NR would, unlike the US, be one of the lower rankings (probably a U or PG). | | | It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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