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Invelos Forums->General: General Discussion |
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Naming conventions around the world |
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Registered: March 14, 2007 | Posts: 1,328 |
| Posted: | | | | Since there seems to be lot of confusion regarding what is a Last name vs. surname vs. family name around the world, I thought it would be interesting to learn about naming conventions around the world. If users can post what they know about naming conventions in their countries, I think it can go a long ways in enlightening us about how to approach building a better program and database.
So, I will start with the good old USA. I am not a geneologist or a census taker, but I do deal with 100s of official names every day in my daily job. US is a melting pot of various cultures around the world, but what follows is what is typical for the majority.
United States of America
In the USA, official names are what is on the birth certificate or passports or other official documents. It's not always the same as what most people call you by (William/ Jefferson/ Clinton vs. Bill// Clinton). In the US, most people are given First name/s, middle name/s, and Last name. Last name is synonymous with surname. Most people would not differentiate between surname and the family name. Surname (greater than 90% of cases) are taken from the father's surname. There are very few instances of double surname or hyphenated surname (mostly in hispanic families). When a woman marries, she most often (~95% of cases) takes on the surname of her husband as her surname. She may keep her maiden surname as her surname (~4% especially if she is in certain professional position). Of the women who take on their husband's surname as their own surname, ~25% change their middle name to their maiden surname (ie. Hillary/ Diane/ Rodham to Hillary/ Rodham/ Clinton). Very rarely, she may conjoin her husband's name to her name to form a hyphenated or double surname (~1%).
First name is usually a single given name at birth. In some parts of the country (south), double first names are also common (ie. Mary Jo, Sue Allen, etc). In many cases, official first names are full length names rather than shortened nick names (William vs. Bill, John vs. Jack, etc), however, this is not always the case.
Middle name/s is also usually a single given name at birth. It can be another given name similar to first name or in many families, name/s to honor other family member or their surname (John/ Fitzgerald/ Kennedy (named for maternal grandfather John/ F/ Fitzgerald) or George/ Herbert Walker/ Bush (named for maternal grandfather George/Herbert/Walker)). Some people also have initial only as their official middle name, however this is relatively uncommon.
So in summary,
First name - Usually a single given name at birth - Usually a full name rather than shortened name - Usually the name a person is called in social setting
Middle name - Usually a single given name at birth/marriage - Often named in honor of another family member - Sometimes changed in woman at marriage to reflect her maiden surname
Last name - Synonymous with surname - Usually a single name taken from the father's surname - Usually adopted from husband's surname at marriage for a woman - Double or hyphenated names are rare except in certain culture
Asian Americans
Asian Americans will usually use western name as their first name and Asian given name as their middle name (small minority will reverse this using Asian given name as their first name and western name as their middle name). Last name or surname is almost always taken from the father's surname and double or hyphenated last names are very rare. Unlike their counterparts in Asia, most woman adopt their husband's surname as their surname with marriage.
First name - Usually western given name - Rarely Asian given name
Middle name - Usually Asian given name - Rarely western given name
Last name - Synonymous with surname - Usually a single name taken from the father's surname - Usually adopted from husband's surname at marriage for a woman - Double or hyphenated names are rare | | | My Home Theater | | | Last edited: by xradman |
| Registered: March 14, 2007 | Posts: 1,328 |
| Posted: | | | | Korea
Official name is what is in the official family register which are kept on file with the local government census office and what is printed on official ID cards and documents. There is usually a single syllable surname (there are rare two syllable surnames) and two syllable given name (there are uncommon single syllable given names). Most names can also be written with traditional Chinese characters (hanja).
Surname is always taken from the father's surname. Woman does not change her surname with marriage and keeps her surname. There is no middle name in Korea. Names are always written surname followed by given name when written in Korean or with Hanja. Names may be reversed when written in English. Two syllable names may be separated with a hyphen or space when written in English and the second syllable may or may not be capitalized.
In summary:
Surname - Usually a single syllable name taken from father's surname - Rarely a double syllable name taken from father's double syllable surname - Woman keeps her surname after marriage
Given name - Usually a double syllable name given at birth - Uncommonly a single syllable name given at birth - Double syllable name can be separated with a hyphen or space or not when written in English - Second syllable of double syllable name can be capitalized or not when written in English
Middle name - No such thing | | | My Home Theater | | | Last edited: by xradman |
| Registered: March 14, 2007 | Posts: 1,328 |
| Posted: | | | | ChinaNaming conventions in China is very similar to Korea. Official name is what is in the official family register which are kept on file with the local government census office and what is printed on official ID cards and documents. There is usually a single syllable surname (there are rare two syllable surnames) and single or two syllable given name (single syllable names are much more common than in Korea, but still less than double syllable given name). Surname is always taken from the father's surname. Woman does not change her surname with marriage and keeps her surname. There is no middle name in China (except in Hong Kong). Names are always written surname followed by given name when written in Chinese. Names may be reversed when written in English. Two syllable names may be separated with a hyphen or space when written in English and the second syllable may or may not be capitalized. In summary: Surname - Usually a single syllable name taken from father's surname - Rarely a double syllable name taken from father's double syllable surname - Woman keeps her surname after marriage Given name - Usually a single or double syllable name given at birth - Double syllable name can be separated with a hyphen or space or not when written in English - Second syllable of double syllable name can be capitalized or not when written in English Middle name - No such thing Exceptions for Hong KongPerhaps because Hong Kong was a British colony for 100 years, western style nick names and middle names are common in Hong Kong. Most often the western name closely mimic phonetic pronunciation of their Chinese given name. However, they can also be completely different. Many actors and actresses also go by their screen names rather than their real names. Almost all Chinese actors/actress/crew with both western name and Chinese name will write their name as Western name/surname/Chinese name when writing in English (ie. David Chiang Dai-wei). This is so that part of their names sound natural to both the western and Chinese audience (David Chiang and Chiang Dai-wei). So in summary Surname - Usually a single syllable name taken from father's surname - Rarely a double syllable name taken from father's double syllable surname - Woman keeps her surname after marriage Given name - Usually a single or double syllable name given at birth - Double syllable name can be separated with a hyphen or space or not when written in English - Second syllable of double syllable name can be capitalized or not when written in English Middle name - Western name or nickname probably comes closest to this definition Additional input from synner_manQuoting synner_man: Quote: Hong Kong naming conventions are pretty much the same as Korean naming conventions, with the addition of the western name. Hong Kong, being a former British colony, required English translations to their films. Many of the actors, actresses and crew adopted an English name to go along with their Chinese one. This, of course, lead to multiple credits for the same actor.
There are two famous actors named Tony Leung. Sometimes they are credited that way, but more often they go by their English name and Chinese name combined: Tony Leung Chiu-Wai and Tony Leung Ka-Fai (sometimes with the dash in their Chinese given name, sometimes without).
Some only go by the Western name (at least, they do when credited using Western characters). Jackie Chan and Jet Li are two famous examples (though they are also credited in Chinese characters under their proper Chinese name). Actor Andy Lau is rarely credited as Andy Lau Tak-Wah (and I don't think I've ever seen him credited as Lau Tak-Wah). Director Andrew Lau is rarely credited as Andrew Lau Wai-Keung or Lau Wai-Keung. Actor Ngai Sing moved to the US and changed his name to Collin Chou (his real Taiwanese name was Chou Siu-Lun), which he now uses exclusively. Sometimes the name isn't even consistent, as Johnnie To was sometimes credited as Johnny To in his earlier films.
Some actors used an English name for a brief time. Lau Ching-Wan tried the name Sean Lau, then dropped it. Even Chow Yun-Fat went by an English name for a brief time: Aman Chow.
There are also the naming conventions of Mandarin names versus Cantonese names. Take Lau Kar-Leung. When he was an action choreographer and director at Shaw Brothers, they used the Mandarin version of his name: Liu Chia-Liang. In the later years, he went by his Cantonese name: Lau Kar-Leung. His "brother" Gordon Liu, can be found under his western name Gordon Liu, his Mandarin name Liu Chia-Hui, his Cantonese name Lau Kar-Fei, or a combination of his western name and Chinese names.
Like Korean and Japanese names, you have a translation problem, which means that the name might not always be consistent. Take Gordon Liu: glancing at HKMDB, they list additional aliases as Lau Ga-Fai, Lau Kir-Fai, Lau Kar-Fai, Liu Jia-Hui, Lau Ka-Fei and Liu Chia-Fai. This is not uncommon in films in the '70s and '80s.
As you can see, Hong Kong naming conventions are not simple (though it isn't difficult to standardize). | | | My Home Theater | | | Last edited: by xradman |
| Registered: March 14, 2007 | Posts: 1,328 |
| | Registered: February 23, 2009 | Reputation: | Posts: 1,580 |
| Posted: | | | | In Japan the convention to write names is: Last name, first name Middle names don't exist in Japanese. A short example: Kurosawa Akira (Kurosawa = last name; Akira = first name).
Please note that more often than not, when romanising Japanese names, they often get switched around, citing first the first name, then the last name, although this is not a general rule. | | | Blu-ray collection DVD collection My Games My Trophies | | | Last edited: by Taro |
| Registered: March 28, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 1,299 |
| Posted: | | | | Sweden Let's start with the simplest first: The name that comes last is your last name. Sometimes that name will be a two parter, usually when it involves titles, like "von Sydow", which is Max von Sydow's last name.
Then you've got the given names. Often the given names follow the same model as in the U.S., meaning someone named Tomas Michael Andersson would be called Tomas by their friends. However, in many other instances that's not the case at all.
There's a term, tilltalsnamn, which literally translates to "address name" (as in when you're being addressed by someone) and this name functions as a first name, regardless of which order it is presented on identifactions such as passports or birth certificates.
So, the aforementioned Tomas Michael Andersson could very well have Michael be his address name, so everyone calls him Michael, his parents intended for him to be called Michael, and Tomas is considered his "andranamn," which literally translates as "other name."
A person has only one "address name" but may have several "other names" and they can appear in any order. Meaning, someone may be named Marcus Tomas Michael Andersson, and by just looking at it written down like that there's no way of knowing which is his "address name." It could be Marcus, Tomas or Michael.
KM | | | Tags, tags, bo bags, banana fana fo fags, mi my mo mags, TAGS! Dolly's not alone. You can also clone profiles. You've got questions? You've got answers? Take the DVD Profiler Wiki for a spin. |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 1,774 |
| Posted: | | | | Germany:First name - Usually a single given name at birth, but double name is possible (i.e. "Anna-Maria" = Anna-Maria//Müller) - Usually a full name rather than shortened name - Usually the name a person is called in social setting Middle name - Usually a single given name at birth/marriage (i.e. "Hans Joachim Müller" = Hans/Joachim/Müller); but two or more are possible (i.e. "Beate/Johanna Maria/Glauch") - Sometimes named in honor of another family member, sometimes just because parents can't decide... ) Last name - Synonymous with surname - Usually a single name taken from the father's surname, but two or more words are possible for titles (i.e. "Max//von Sydow" or "Ursula//von der Leyen") - Usually adopted from husband's surname at marriage for a woman - Double names are not so rare, often to reflect the maiden surname of a woman after marrying (i.e. "Julia Meier" marries "Klaus Schmidt": now Julia can decide to be "Julia//Schmidt", "Julia//Schmidt-Meier" or "Julia//Meier-Schmidt"; Klaus stays "Klaus//Schmidt") Funny Fact: In Bavaria it was not so uncommon to give a man the middle-name "Maria". I think because of the strong catholic influence. (i.e. "Florian/Maria/Huber") | | | Last edited: by SpaceFreakMicha |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 485 |
| Posted: | | | | Here is a first try for the Netherlands.
There is no concept of first name. Instead, one's parents give a set of given names = "voornaam" pl. "voornamen" (1 up to many, most people have 2 to 4). One's calling name ("roepnaam") is often the first given name, though not always in full (Johannes becomes Jan or Johan). But it can be one of the other given names (personally, my 3rd given name is my calling name). Translation-wise, we usually equate the given names with first names (note the plural). But there is no concept of one single first name.
There is no concept of middle name. However, in the context of DVD Profiler the second and more given names of Dutch people are usually placed in the middle name field.
Last name = surname = family name = "achternaam". That said, the last name can consist of more than one word. If the family name is derived from being from a city of village, "van" is put before the city name. So a family name can be "van Amsterdam" which is sorted in name lists under "A". Dutch family names can be quite extensive and extends beyond named places. For example "van der Weide" (litt: "from the meadow") does exist and is sorted under "W". Also, full double word or triple words in the surname exist. Historically these are (usually) descendants from the upper class non-aristocracy.
Aristocracy has even more variations in the last name. The family name may be identical to the title to the point that, formally, a family has a title but no real family name. So John Doe can be John, count of Doe. Could also be John Doe, count of XYZ. Of course, double and triple words in the surname occur as well here.
As for maried couples. It used to be simple. The woman could take the man's name, and most did. The man's surname would then become the first word in the woman's surname, followed by a hyphen, and then her original family name. (miss X marrying mr Y would become mrs Y-X. The man's surname would become the surname of any children. However, emancipation caused a recent change of the law and the man can now opt for adapting the woman's name. With also the reverse for children's surnames.
All full rules on names in the Netherlands could probably fuel many wiki pages, but I guess the above covers most cases. | | | Eric
If it is important, say it. Otherwise, let silence speak. | | | Last edited: by eommen |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 485 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting SpaceFreakMicha: Quote: Germany:
Funny Fact: In Bavaria it was not so uncommon to give a man the middle-name "Maria". I think because of the strong catholic influence. (i.e. "Florian/Maria/Huber") Same here in the Netherlands. In the catholic southern provinces people often have 3 to 4 given names. If one of them is "M.", it is a safe bet this stands for "Maria". Even if it's a man. | | | Eric
If it is important, say it. Otherwise, let silence speak. |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 1,774 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting Astrakan: Quote: Sweden Then you've got the given names. Often the given names follow the same model as in the U.S., meaning someone named Tomas Michael Andersson would be called Tomas by their friends. However, in many other instances that's not the case at all.
There's a term, tilltalsnamn, which literally translates to "address name" (as in when you're being addressed by someone) and this name functions as a first name, regardless of which order it is presented on identifactions such as passports or birth certificates.
So, the aforementioned Tomas Michael Andersson could very well have Michael be his address name, so everyone calls him Michael, his parents intended for him to be called Michael, and Tomas is considered his "andranamn," which literally translates as "other name."
A person has only one "address name" but may have several "other names" and they can appear in any order. Meaning, someone may be named Marcus Tomas Michael Andersson, and by just looking at it written down like that there's no way of knowing which is his "address name." It could be Marcus, Tomas or Michael.
KM I forgot to mention it above, the same is possible in germany. (i.e. my name is "Jürgen/Michael/Ritzleben", but (thank god) everybody calls me "Michael") | | | Last edited: by SpaceFreakMicha |
| Registered: May 19, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 6,730 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting eommen: Quote: Quoting SpaceFreakMicha:
Quote: Germany:
Funny Fact: In Bavaria it was not so uncommon to give a man the middle-name "Maria". I think because of the strong catholic influence. (i.e. "Florian/Maria/Huber")
Same here in the Netherlands. In the catholic southern provinces people often have 3 to 4 given names. If one of them is "M.", it is a safe bet this stands for "Maria". Even if it's a man. In Germany this is only possible if you have "Gender indicating first name" means a name that can only be used for a boy or a girl. Means: Karl Maria Brandauer is allowed, Kai Maria Brandauer is not. | | | It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up! But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid?
Registrant since 05/22/2003 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 1,774 |
| Posted: | | | | | | | Last edited: by SpaceFreakMicha |
| | T!M | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 8,736 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting SpaceFreakMicha: Quote: - Double names are not so rare, often to reflect the maiden surname of a woman after marrying (i.e. "Julia Meier" marries "Klaus Schmidt": now Julia can decide to be "Julia//Schmidt", "Julia//Schmidt-Meier" or "Julia//Meier-Schmidt") Indeed. In light of the recent discussions, it may be good to stress that it never becomes Julia/Schmidt/Meier - once a last name, always a last name. |
| Registered: March 14, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 6,745 |
| Posted: | | | | And then there's the rare issue of nobility in Germany. Even though there is no official nobility in Germany anymore the names remain.
For example, our current Federal Minister for Economics and Technology is called "Karl-Theodor Maria Nikolaus Johann Jacob Philipp Franz Joseph Sylvester Freiherr von und zu Guttenberg". Luckily he doesn't appear in movies, but his lastname is "Freiherr von und zu Guttenberg" (and he usually goes by the name "Karl-Theodor zu Guttenberg") | | | Karsten DVD Collectors Online
| | | Last edited: by DJ Doena |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation: | Posts: 485 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting DJ Doena: Quote: ...For example, our current Federal Minister for Economics and Technology is called "Karl-Theodor Maria Nikolaus Johann Jacob Philipp Franz Joseph Sylvester Freiherr von und zu Guttenberg". Luckily he doesn't appear in movies, but his lastname is "Freiherr von und zu Guttenberg" (and he usually goes by the name "Karl-Theodor zu Guttenberg") Nice example, which could also happen in the Netherlands. Actually, the "von und zu" construct happens in some family names here too. For those not initiated in German, "Freiherr von und zu Guttenberg" means Baron from and at Guttenberg. Also notice, there is no family name outside the title. Perhaps Ken could write him a letter not to appear in movies (or documentaries...) for fear of adapting DVD Profiler once again | | | Eric
If it is important, say it. Otherwise, let silence speak. |
| Registered: March 15, 2007 | Posts: 374 |
| Posted: | | | | Quoting SpaceFreakMicha: Quote: Germany:
First name - Usually a single given name at birth, but double name is possible (i.e. "Anna-Maria" = Anna-Maria//Müller) - Usually a full name rather than shortened name - Usually the name a person is called in social setting
Middle name - Usually a single given name at birth/marriage (i.e. "Hans Joachim Müller" = Hans/Joachim/Müller); but two or more are possible (i.e. "Beate/Johanna Maria/Glauch") - Sometimes named in honor of another family member, sometimes just because parents can't decide... )
Last name - Synonymous with surname - Usually a single name taken from the father's surname, but two or more words are possible for titles (i.e. "Max//von Sydow" or "Ursula//von der Leyen") - Usually adopted from husband's surname at marriage for a woman - Double names are not so rare, often to reflect the maiden surname of a woman after marrying (i.e. "Julia Meier" marries "Klaus Schmidt": now Julia can decide to be "Julia//Schmidt", "Julia//Schmidt-Meier" or "Julia//Meier-Schmidt"; Klaus stays "Klaus//Schmidt")
Funny Fact: In Bavaria it was not so uncommon to give a man the middle-name "Maria". I think because of the strong catholic influence. (i.e. "Florian/Maria/Huber") I am afraid I have to disagree, there is nothing like a middle name in Germany, only the possibility to have more than one first name. |
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